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This will likely end up in the US Supreme Court so victory may be short lived. This is a HUGE step for California though. Glad to see the judiciary exercising some oversight on these ridiculously invasive laws.

I'm still trying to figure it out but I believe that you will still be required to apply for a CCW but that the sheriff can no longer require "good cause". You simply pay your fees and complete the required training.


http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-concealed-weapons-20140214,0,1930416.story#axzz2tnJjaGZn


http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/02/1...-in-california/

SAN FRANCISCO — In a significant victory for gun owners, a divided federal appeals court Thursday struck down California rules that permit counties to restrict as they see fit the right to carry a concealed weapon in public.
The 2-1 ruling by a U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals panel would overturn restrictions on carrying concealed handguns, primarily affecting California's most populated regions, including Los Angeles, Orange County, San Diego and San Francisco.

The majority said the restrictions violate the 2nd Amendment's guarantee of the right to bear arms because they deny law-abiding citizens the ability to carry weapons in public unless they show they need the protection for specific reasons.

"We are not holding that the Second Amendment requires the states to permit concealed carry," Judge Diarmuid O'Scannlain, a Reagan appointee, wrote for the panel. "But the Second Amendment does require that the states permit some form of carry for self-defense outside the home."

The decision was hailed by gun rights advocates, who said citizens must have the right to protect themselves in public. Proponents of stricter gun control described the ruling as an aberrant and reckless expansion of law that would lead to more gun violence.

California's rules will remain in effect for the foreseeable future, pending appeals. Officials in San Diego County said they may seek a rehearing before a larger 9th Circuit panel, and experts said the issue would eventually be decided by the U.S. Supreme Court.

Thursday's decision stems from a change in state law in 2012 that took away the right of residents to carry unloaded guns in public, with ammunition toted separately. Before the ban was enacted, courts routinely upheld restrictions on carrying concealed weapons. Gun owners argued that the ban and restrictions on concealed weapons made it impossible to defend themselves in public.

California leaves it to counties to decide permit requirements for carrying concealed weapons in public, and the rules in the state's urban centers are more restrictive than in other areas.
Gun owners who were denied permits by San Diego County sued, charging their federal constitutional rights had been denied. Although they were trained in gun use and had met background checks, they could not cite specific reasons why they needed the weapons.

"Given this requirement, the `typical' responsible, law-abiding citizen in San Diego County cannot bear arms in public for self-defense," wrote O'Scannlain, who was joined by Judge Consuelo Callahan, an appointee of former President George W. Bush.

The ruling, by two of the 9th Circuit's most conservative judges, conflicted with holdings in most other circuits and established gun rights beyond what the U.S. Supreme Court has guaranteed. The high court has applied the 2nd Amendment in the context of possessing guns in the home, not in the streets, experts said.

Judge Sidney Thomas dissented, arguing that Thursday's decision "upends the entire California firearm regulatory scheme" and "needlessly intrudes and disrupts valid and constitutional legislative choices."

Thomas, a Clinton appointee, said the 2nd Amendment has never been interpreted to protect concealed carrying of guns in public and noted that the state of California was not named as a defendant, though its rules were effectively being struck down.

Senior Deputy San Diego County Counsel James Chapin, who represented San Diego in the case, called the lawsuit that led to Thursday's decision an "end run" against the state's new ban on openly carrying guns in public.

"What they really want to do is strike down California's open carry ban," Chapin said. "That's really what this is about."
Erwin Chemerinsky, a constitutional law expert at UC Irvine's School of Law, expressed doubt that the decision would be upheld by a larger 9th Circuit panel, though the outcome might depend on which judges were randomly chosen to decide the case.
UCLA professor Adam Winkler, an expert on gun laws, called the ruling "a huge victory for gun owners in California."
"They have been seeking the right to carry concealed weapons for years now," Winkler said.

Citing the 2012 ban on the open carrying of guns, Winkler said: "Gun control advocates have no one but themselves to blame for this ruling. You have to give someone some option to carry a gun."

He said that the ban on openly carrying unloaded guns affected relatively few people because most gun owners don't want the attention and questions that guns in public attract. But many more people might apply to carry concealed weapons, he said. "If you don't want many guns on the street, the answer is open carry," Winkler said.

Chuck Michel, who represented the gun owners in the case, said the suit targeted the San Diego sheriff because the county has an "active client base" of 2nd Amendment supporters. He said the county's rules discouraged gun owners from even applying for a concealed weapon permit.

The ruling affects only California and Hawaii among 9th Circuit states because the others have rules that favor the granting of permits to carry guns in public, according to Eugene Volokh, a professor of constitutional law at UCLA.

"California's rules are essentially unconstitutional because the rule is, your right to carry a gun is at the mercy of the sheriff," Volokh said.

Dianne Jacob, chairwoman of the San Diego County Board of Supervisors, said her initial reaction was positive."I have no problem with law-abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons in the name of self-defense," Jacob said.

Gun control advocates expressed hope the decision would be overturned.

"The parents of Jordan Davis [a Florida teen allegedly slain for playing rap music too loudly at a gas station] and Trayvon Martin, whose children were killed by licensed concealed-carry holders, could educate the court about the real dangers posed by this legal error," said Jonathan Lowy, director of the Legal Action Project for the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence.




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thats good news for CA. The specific reason why they need / want to carry weapons in public is cited pretty clearly in the 2nd amendment. I honestly do not see how they legally got away with this bull shit restriction for so long.

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Same as Chicago's gun ban that got reversed. Shit is straight up unconstitutional. About time the liberal blue states get with it.



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Probably won't change much before it goes back to court. As it is right now, if you live in a major metropolitan area, it can take 6 months or more to even get an appointment with the local law enforcement office to submit your CCW application. I'm assuming the appointment requests are going to be flooding in now, which probably means the appointment dates will be so far out you won't even get one before the next court decision.




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-Concealed weapons now allowed in national parks
-Carry laws for certain schools
-Reduced background checks
-Anti-Gun laws getting struck down in Federal Courts
-Stand YER Ground laws have legalized murder

You guys should thanks Obama for giving the NRA and gun owners more FREEDOMS!! then ever before in recent history. Now stop being paranoid and realize you have bought enough ammo to live through a IRL season of Rust.



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The gun debate never made a lot of sense to me, of course I'm coming at it from a slightly different background.

http://www.adn.com/2013/02/25/2802136/alaska-house-passes-bill-challenging.html

Is an example of the drastically different tone this sort of thing takes where I'm from. In Alaska you don't even need a license to concealed carry. Other than some zoning for schools and stuff, the only important rule is if you're talking to a cop, you have to tell him you're carrying.

In Illinois this shit is hilariously skewed the other way around. Bringing a gun somewhere is like bringing a starving tiger into the room. There's this obvious nervous terror about them you can hear in everyone's voices when they talk about them.

It actually makes me think that, as pro gun as I am, this shit ought to be decided regionally. I'm fine with the legislature of a culture that's nervous or uncomfortable about guns trying to interpret all the ineptly-crafted gun laws as restrictively as they want. I say that as someone who thinks that the entire logical foundation of gun control is the single most ass backwards idea I have ever heard. It is literally "Wolf problem? Add more sheep" incarnate.

But when I hear how people who grow up in gun-free cultures react to them, it makes me think that maybe their populations are too skittish about guns to get any constructive use out of them. California is the kind of place where Feinstein's "150 Big Meany Things that Scare Me" gun laws get some traction. I may be stereotyping here, but I can't help but think that any region that tries to restrict 1890's garage-build technology because of a visceral reaction might not have the collective temperament to handle the idea that anyone at any time might be holding the device that most of them are irrationally and reflexively terrified of.


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California is just a weird animal altogether when it comes to laws and politics. We are home to the gayest city in America which also happens to have a gross median income way above most of the rest of the country and yet we struck down gay marriage through a ballot initiative.

We were the first state to legalize medicinal marijuana and yet recreational marijuana didn't pass while other states did pass it. How does that work? Ok, fine, go to a "pot doc" and pay $150 to get a script for pot and I'm okay with it but without that piece of paper that says you "need" it, NOT OKAY. eh? We won't even get into the tax revenue that was lost on that decision.

I am with you though Hexen. The gun debate is sheer lunacy to me. This is especially true because when you look at statistics, fear of gun violence is irrational. You're many times more likely to die from a myriad of other causes, many of which are directly tied to lifestyle and nutrition choices. Fuck eating healthier and exercising to prolong my life, let's make an issue out of guns and restrict other peoples' freedoms because I'm SKURRED OF GUNS!!!! The news told me it's a big problem!




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That is awesome news, i feel much more safe now knowing that the highly intelligent californians i drive with in the morning are now carrying hidden weapons.


"In the absence of orders, find something and kill it." -Field Marshall Obs
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Nah you still have to get a permit, which requires background checks and training courses, at least from what I could tell by reading. So yea some might be armed, but it's not open season for anyone who wants to. There's still restrictions.

The main issue is that previously, law enforcement required you to show good cause in order to get a CCW. Many jurisdictions were blanketly denying pretty much all requests and there was no specific litmus test for what constitutes "good cause". That was up to the discretion of the police. What ended up happening in many locales is only people who were well connected were getting them.

In any case Obs, I don't think the people you need to fear are people that legally purchased a gun, took training courses and applied for a CCW through law enforcement. Those people know that homicide outside self defense = life in jail.




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Just allowing concealed carry at all doesn't strike me as that big of a deal, particularly since ultralib bureaucrats are going to make the process as difficult as possible. For that same reason you won't get much of the harm or good that comes from having more guns around.

On a day to day basis though, it really only makes sense to have a lot of guns around if you have a pre-existing responsible gun culture. California is so politically hyperactive that I don't think there's much room for that kind of thing to germinate.


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