Lords of Death Forums Lords of Death Forums LoD General Discussion Glad I'm not in Ferguson...

Vermithrax]Wow.....law enforcement just don't know when to quit. I'm glad this fuckhead wrote this article though. All he's done is help spread awareness about how fucked up the attitude of some cops are. He really picked a bad time to do this.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/20/us/ferguson-column-police-reaction/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Vermithrax]Wow.....law enforcement just don't know when to quit. I'm glad this fuckhead wrote this article though. All he's done is help spread awareness about how fucked up the attitude of some cops are. He really picked a bad time to do this.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/20/us/ferguson-column-police-reaction/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Godsmak]

He actually made great points.

If people only realized the opposite side of the coin, from a LEO's perspective of dealing with people at their lowest day in and day out, how ridiculous that is for other human beings (cops are human too) to take on a daily basis, they might understand that cooperation is the smartest thing any civilian can do when you are targeted by the police. Of course there are a lot of retards who are in law enforcement, that's just the human population, we are flawed, some more than others. There are bad apples in every sector of employment throughout the world, everywhere.

Vermithrax]Well first things first, while looking for vids, I found this one. Dude, tell me this is not fucking Kenny Powers driving this car??? Voice is spot on. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rlw4RXD6v0o)

In response to your question, where to begin?

In light of what's going in MO? Everything. What a fucking dumbass. Do you really think it's wise for a cop to write, "...here is the bottom line: if you don't want to get shot, tased, pepper-sprayed, struck with a baton or thrown to the ground, just do what I tell you,"? Considering everything that's going on down there and the hostility between police and civilians and the underlying racial tension, do you really believe this was an appropriate time to make these kinds of comments?

Outside of the poor timing, there's many other reasons what he said is wrong.

From the LAPD's website: "To Protect and to Serve" became the official motto of the Police Academy, and it was kept constantly before the officers in training as the aim and purpose of their profession. I want you to tell me how "Do what I tell you or I'm going to physically hurt you" jives with that motto?

There are of course situations when his statements would make sense. Picking one out of millions of possible situations, if he locates a guy dressed in all black running out of a parking lot after a burglar alarm goes off. Yea, in that case, the guy should probably do exactly as he's told. Or a DV call. It's widely known how dangerous DV calls are for officers. People are already angry and out of control when the police show up. In that situation, I'd expect an officer to more aggressive about asserting his authority with a person who is already irate and unpredictable.

However, there's also situations where the cops make unreasonable and sometimes unlawful demands for which they have no authority or legal backing. You can find a plethora of videos on youtube of cops ordering civilians to stop filming them. ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izyC_TaVh8M )That's not a lawful order and you of all people can back me up on that. Unless I'm interfering with an investigation (subjective of course), I have the right to film police when they're on duty. Should I expect then, based on this officers article, that if a cop gives me an unlawful command to stop filming him that I'm going to be physically hurt if I refuse to obey it? Outside of youtube videos Sonya, I've had police order me to stop filming them before, during a friend's DUI stop. I refused. They backed down because they knew they had no grounds to prevent me from doing so.

What about other times when they unlawfully demand ID when they have no reasonable suspicion to believe someone has committed or is about to commit a crime? If I refuse to show ID, should I be worried I'm going to get hurt? How about this video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rlw4RXD6v0o )? 20 minutes of these cops fucking with this guy and trying to get his ID because he was walking down the street and allegedly "fit a description". The guy obviously knows EXACTLY how reasonable suspicion works. Why did they continue to fuck with him? They point a gun at him and a pull out a taser in a threatening way. And for what? Dude was minding his business walking down the street. This kind of shit just shouldn't fucking happen. If the dude was white and in Granite Bay or Irvine, you know he wouldn't be dealing with this shit. But because he's Mexican (it sounds like), he's getting fucked with for no reason.

In this vid ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytb2OF7U1IU ), cop tries to coerce the guy into answering his questions at a DUI stop. He tells him he HAS to answer them because he came through the checkpoint. You and I both know the driver has zero obligation to answer any questions under any circumstances, but the cops lie and say he does. Cop even goes as far as to say "...when you pull this kind of crap." So now asserting your 5th amendment right not to answer questions to police is "pulling crap"? When did it become a bad thing to stand up an assert the rights that our constitution guarantees you?

Cops are not always right Sonya. You're a really smart guy and it took you years of education and experience to understand the law. Most cops I've met aren't at your level of intelligence and certainly don't have your training. But the author of that article is basically saying that in the moment, the cop is always right and you better do what you're told if you don't want to suffer physical harm and you can file a complaint later. Considering cops do sometimes blatantly lie (it's a felony for you to record me!) and misinform people about what their rights are and do sometimes blatantly misconstrue what questions/commands people are required to answer/obey, I think saying "do what I say or you're going to get hurt" is a slippery fucking slope. It's also generally a poor fucking attitude for someone who's job is SUPPOSED to be protecting and serving his community.

I know this will not change your mind. We've been over this and your overall view about these kinda of things is just fundamentally and irreconcilably different than mine. Based on your previous posts, I'd imagine you're going to take the position that the guy in the 20 min vid should have just cooperated and shown his ID and then he could have been on his way. Because he was uncooperative, they thought he was the guy, blah blah. I disagree entirely. I think if I'm walking down the street minding my own business, I should be left the fuck alone. I don't give a shit if they're looking for someone who "looks like me". That's subjective bullshit and it's not my fucking problem.

Rainman]

You do know that Cops are legally allowed to lie, right? Knowing your rights is your responsibility. If you aren't smart enough to know what requests the police are legally allowed to make, then maybe you aren't smart enough to talk back to the police.

The first video you put up shows the guy willfully staying and talking to the police after they say he is not detained. When they say you are not detained you walk away and you don't stop to talk to them again. If they want to stop you they put handcuffs on you. It's obvious this guy wanted to "prove" he knew his rights. If he kept walking and the cops detained him on video he would be rolling in Six Figure Settlement Money. His dumbass stopped to chat. It wasn't the cops who detained him, he detained himself. This is the number one mistake I see on youtube videos with dorks pretending their rights were violated.

When a cop says STOP, you stop. When a cop says "Excuse me Sir", you do whatever the fuck you please.